By Seb Janacek, 4 February 2005 07:00
COMMENT Apple is known almost as much for its loyal fan base as for its innovative products. But, asks Seb Janacek, could their outspoken manner be hurting the company's stab at the corporate world?
Hell hath no fury like a Mac user scorned. Run an article about Apple and you usually get a steady trickle of reader comments. Run one that questions or criticises any aspect of Apple strategy, products or leadership and the trickle becomes a deluge. And the accusations of 'Mac bashing' soon follow.
Apple has a fiercely loyal fan base that would be the envy of any other company on the planet and which helped sustain the company's fortunes through the dark days and into its current age of relative plenty.
Mac users have traditionally viewed themselves as being separate from the rest of the pack and renown for 'thinking different'. Within the fan base exists a highly vocal minority which tolerates no criticism of its beloved company and attacks any real (or indeed imagined) slight of Apple in online fora with savage intensity.
It's this minority that seems to be under some form of mass hypnosis - perhaps some far-reaching extension of Steve Jobs' 'reality distortion field' - thinking that Apple can do no wrong and is a panacea for all the IT wrongs in the world.
I've noticed that two recent articles on silicon.com caused particular offence. In one, Dell CEO Kevin Rollins claimed the iPod is just a passing fad. In the second, the CIO Jury was asked whether Apple is a viable contender for businesses. Eleven out of the 12 CIOs said no with one branding the company "irrelevant" to business.
My editors at silicon.com tell me soon after these articles were posted, the floodgates opened and the abuse poured in. They say a great many comments were edited for language, while others were simply deleted because the contents were deemed inappropriate. Many questioned the competence and motivation of our CIOs. It didn't make pretty reading.
Like it or not, those questioned in the article were 12 senior IT managers putting their own thoughts to Apple's chances at working its way onto the desks of businesses other than graphic design agencies or publishing companies. Exactly the kind of people that need to be convinced of the merits of Apple in the workplace.
Apple is determined to carve out a niche for itself in the corporate space. It recently upgraded products its Xserve server range, introduced Xsan, an enterprise storage solution, and dedicated a section on its website to IT pros. The IT Pro pages - complete with a reassuring picture of a server with a tangle of multi-coloured wires sticking out of the back of it - aim to demystify some the misconceptions surrounding Macs, profile the company's product range and highlight some of the benefits of the Unix-powered OS X operating systems. Mmm, BSD.
Meanwhile the Mac mini, though touted as a consumer machine, has huge merits as an office desktop not least by affording the next generation of IT support staff the opportunity to spend less time patching computers and updating antivirus software and more time learning useful things like Unix and database administration. Tempting prospect, isn't it?
The company, for so long considered an also-ran in the corporate sphere, is now getting serious about its corporate credentials. It's real progress for the company that people are at least beginning to ask these questions again.
Despite recent high-profile success with both Cisco and Oracle getting onboard, the Cupertino company faces a battle for recognition. The barriers aren't insurmountable, as evidenced by the ever increasing success of Linux - another example of a technology with a fan base that flamed early articles questioning the operating system's chances of making it onto the corporate server.
Sections of the Linux community have successfully ditched the geeky image, bought a suit and gained heavyweight business credentials from the likes of IBM. Apple faces a similar challenge.
The company's fans have a part to play in helping this happen. Among the hundreds of comments posted on Apple articles, it's refreshing to see an increasing amount of feedback from IT managers, directors and consultants making legitimate cases for the company's products in the corporate space.
However, the other sort of comments need to be tempered. Flame in haste and you may repent later. An incisive comment about how more expensive Macs may actually lower a company's total cost of ownership may be lost among comments calling critics of the company "dorks", "idiots" and "Steve Ballmer's right-hand pit stain" (an actual comment by a silicon.com reader) or worse - if that's possible.
The collective moral outrage does Apple evangelists, and by extension the company itself, no favours. The vitriol seems particularly misplaced in online forums read worldwide by thousands of senior technology professionals and business decision makers holding the IT purse strings.
With its new products, overflowing coffers and über-brand, Apple has the best chance in years of making serious inroads into the corporate space.
Apple has grown up, one can only hope that this particular vocal minority of its fans can follow suit.
Peace. (And for the record: Made on a Mac)
Comments
There are 84 comments. Join the discussion
1. Arlen Owens II
Yes, I do think the Mac community, of which I am a part needs to mature, like the Linux people. However, my experience as a Mac user in a corporate environment has been horrifying....I am sure that many of the Mac users out there have been subjected to unprovoked verbal attacks on a regular basis. Makes one a little testy after a while! I have finally learned to just laugh it off and try not to get sucked into to those conversations...just enjoy my platform for what it is and the benefits it provides me. AND, my better attitude seems to quench the fires of those who were just hoping for a nasty "Mac user response".
2. anonymous
Mr. Janacek,
I agree . . . there really is no place for profanity and ill placed name calling. However, I , along with most other Mac users, have LONG been frustrated with the misinformation and obvious bias by many IT journalists. This has translated into many decisions being made where Macs have been relegated to the surplus bin--as evidenced in many school systems where PC infrastructures have replaced Mac systems. I can understand the fevered pitch of those of us who use and know Mac IT, that the TRUTH be told about the platforms' strengths, and educated commentary of its weaknessess. I believe what we Mac enthusiasts' would like to see is a BALANCED and factual presentation of views expressed by IT journalists. Like you, I have little patience for those who cannot express themselves without resorting to profanity or gross accusations about one's heritage or intelligence, but I am equally disturbed by the amount of "factless" journalism being pushed out about the Mac platform. I suspect, that many such articles are written simply to "stir" up the bees.
3. Robert Jung
If any corporate or IT decision maker lets a product's users influence -- in any way, shape, or form -- their decision of whether or not the product is a feasible fit for their needs, I would seriously question the competency of their decision-making process.
4. anonymous
I recently had a person approach me and tell me that my loyalty to Apple was like a religion. That comment of course was made as his 30 laptops in a hands on on presentation were found to have a really nasty worm and kicked off the network thus spoiling his workshop. There were a few of us that chose to not use his laptops but rather use our Powerbooks since the presentation was web based. I made the mistake of commenting that anyone that would like to was more than welcome to huddle around my 17" powerbook and we could continue the discussion. This presenter, who had never owned a Mac, took that as a direct PC dig. Although I have seen Mac Zealots make Mac fools of themselves from time to time it is far more the PC IT manager, that has not used a Mac since 1984 and lived through the DOS years cussing the command line inefficiencies of the Macintosh, that make the absolute fools of themselves. Those who read the studies on TCO and ignore the fact that Macs are less expensive in the long term. Those that still believe that Microsoft office on a Mac must be some kind of bastardized version created by Apple not the Benevolent Microsoft. Those home users who seriously believe that Windows Media Maker can compete with Apples iLife suite. I do see Mac Zealots but PC Weenies are just as bad and even more closed minded.
5. anonymous
What the average PC user doesn't understand is how many gratuitous insults Mac users put up with. "Didn't Apple go out of business?" "Why did you pay more for a slower computer? Are you an idiot?" "Ease of use? I guess that matters if you don't know how to use computers, but ..."
That sort of treatment naturally breeds a resentful and defensive mindset.
Mac zealotry is also driven by the culture of the online forums where computer platforms are discussed. The "rabid Mac fans" you talk about develop their debating tactics yelling at equally rabid Windows fans.
Emotions run very high on both sides. Apple's biggest obstacle to entering the corporate market isn't its own customers, but the entrenched prejudices of IT staffs.
6. William Petty
I am sure that there are some people who flame just because they can. What gets my dander up is when people in positions of power make comments that are absolutely untrue. Most of the IT comments were irrelevant to the heart of the matter. If they choose to venture forth with comments that show their ignorance, then they certainly need to be berated. Not viciously, but professionally. But, even then, they keep their minds closed, which keeps them employed. I never said they were stupid, just ignorant of the facts.
7. Kevin J. Weise
I don't condone the childish attacks of the Mac-faithful about which you write. I am grateful that someone realizes these personal attacks are the work of a few and notthe Mac community as a whole. But I can understand the everpresent level of frustation that may be present in some of them. I am one of a few Macintosh advocates where I work, and I put up with alot of "professional abuse" from Microsoft zealots, those who figure MS can do no wrong despite the criminal conviction of abusive monopoly practices, despite the swiss-cheese security & viruses du jour, despite the inconsistent interfaces and extreme bloat of its software. One tries to deal with the IT department on a professional level, to explain how a Mac could be used and be useful in the corporate environment, only to be shot down by bigots who haven't used a Mac in a decade (if ever) because they won't allow a "toy computer" on their network. One may see the fury of the Mac zealots online from time to time. I see the pigheadedness and unjustified self-righteous scorn of Windows zealots on pretty much a daily or weekly basis. They would rather rebuild their mail servers from the ground up two or three times a year (because it gets corrupted by spam & viruses) and lock everyone out of the network who doesn't run a Windows-only anti-virus program than consider allowing employees to use Macintosh systems that won't contribute to these problems. These events have actually occurred at my place of employment in the last year, and the IT dep't head was just replaced last week. The whole IT situation is outrageous, yet the Mac faithful are the ones who get a bad rap when they can no longer contain the outrage.
8. anonymous
The last thing an 'IT' manager wants is for Apple systems to be put in place. What would the company do with their job?
Apple isn't about putting IT managers in front of end users, it's about empowering the end user to a point that s/he doesn't need an overpaid 'IT' manager.
9. Zato
"Apple has grown up, one can only hope that this particular vocal minority of its fans can follow suit."
And maybe silicon.com will grow up to be real journalists instead of Microsoft monkey-boy trolls and flamebaiters.
(Ed note. In so many ways this probably proves a point.)
10. anonymous
I have to agree that there are loons on both sides of the Mac-Windows debate. Apple's resurgence is unfortunately reigniting the old passions. A non-profit organization board of which I am the president was meeting at my house a while back. One of the board members was bragging about his new cheapo $400 PC that included all the usual poorly constructed stuff. For some reason he made a comment about getting a "real computer," not a Mac. Chuckles all around, wondering how I would respond. Now ten paces away was my iMac G4 with all its UNIX glory, Firewire, USB hub, scanner, photo printer, MS Office, iLife, lots of wonderful software ... but I just let it go. There was no point in arguing with that kind of ignorance, upsetting the harmony of our outfit, even though I could have slashed this guy to pieces with a few well-chosen observations. And I wonder to this day if he ever got all his e-mail transferred from his old system. Apple's loyalists could gain more influence if they -- we -- would tone down the rhetoric. Let the other side commit the rhetorical hari kari.
11. Jefre Hargroder
I think after reading the comments thus far you are getting a clearer and clearer picture of what the real mac community is like, a gathering of mature people who have collected thoughts and can present them in a compatent way.
Jefre
12. Jefre Hargroder
I think after reading the comments thus far you are getting a clearer and clearer picture of what the real mac community is like, a gathering of mature people who have collected thoughts and can present them in a compatent way.
13. anonymous
Yes, there are plenty of foaming at the mouth Mac fanatics, but there are just as many Windows fanatics that take every chance to put down Mac users. And no, I do not condone the fanatical behavior.
As for the opinion of 12 IT managers? What systems do they use and how does that impact their opinion? I would guess most or all use Windows in the workplace and have multiple reasons for seeing the status quo upheld: job security and that it validates their choices are two easy ones. While their opinions might be important, they are not an unbiased source.
14. Rene
I think the people at Mac Daily News said it best: 'In our experience, legitimate criticism of Apple, where the criticism is based on facts, is well-received by the majority of the "Mac community." It's the criticism of Apple based upon myths, outright untruths, and ignorance that elicits venom from Mac users. Regardless, a well-thought-out and reasoned response is usually the best tack to take if you want to be effective and convince someone that they're mistaken. But, where's the fun in that?'
15. Dr. Ronald D. Leppke
One step toward maturation of Mac enthusiasts might be to read a Silicon.com article about that much larger segment of Mac fans that respond with thoughtfulness and fairness. There are many of us who are very well educated and, because of our training in research and evaluation as one example, have sincere misgivings about the veracity of a given Mac analysis or review, but express these misgivings in a mature and reasonable fashion.
16. anonymous
Robert Jung said,
"If any corporate or IT decision maker lets a product's users influence -- in any way, shape, or form -- their decision of whether or not the product is a feasible fit for their needs, I would seriously question the competency of their decision-making process."
I would argue exactly the opposite. Any manager who DOESN'T consider their users opinions when deciding on software or hardware is setting themselves up for a big fall. Why? Because it is the users who will have to suffer if the product is poorly designed or inadequate. This leads to alienation, an 'Us against Them' attitude and poor cooperation. IT folks have to recognize that their job is enabling and supportive. If they impose systems on users without consultation and the inevitable problems arise, disenfrachised users will simply complain to management, IT will take the heat and full responsibility. Involving your users from the beginnning with users committees, surveys and consultation ensures that support is a joint responsibility. Get your users onside and they will be part of the solution, not just whining complainers. I have seen it happen.
17. Andrew Bowman
As other posters have made clear, it's not the criticism itself which draws most of the irritated flames and responses (though it will get some), but the fact that the criticism is either biased, untrue, misleading, encouraging FUD, or misinformed.
If you check the articles at Macsurfer.com, I think you'll find many many pages and articles criticizing Apple products (iWork, Mac Mini, iPod Shuffle) which do not draw the same responses and flames the recent articles here received.
The difference is that these criticisms are the informed and constructive kind. Many of them are made by Mac users. Some of them don't use Macs, but are fair and intelligent in their discussion. They discuss the entirety of the product, what's good and what's bad. The goal here is not to bash (as the articles here seemed to suggest), but to analyze the products capabilities and potential and see where they can be improved.
Contrast this with the two articles which drew flames. In the first, the Dell CEO outright dismisses the iPod. Not important or worthy enough to be of notice. This in and of itself can stir up a little anger. However, it IS the CEO of Dell speaking here, so it's really no surprise he would dismiss a competitor.
The second article, the CIO Jury, raised the red flag by declaring Apple as "irrelevant." It's the same as the Dell CEO, a dismissal. Not worthy of notice. Of course, this was the remark of one member, not the group as a whole.
18. anonymous
Well said. The downside of the 'Net is that everybody's voice is equal in it's access to e-mail- trools, over zealous teens and others that could use a significant other. Flaming may be fun, but it does more harm than good.
Apple could do itself a favor by investing some of the $6.5 Billion (US) into the future of it's developer and IT base. Grants to Universities and Colleges to encourage instruction in Objective-C and the Mac Developer Tools (X-Code) would bring a great return on it's investment.
Seeding a number of important and influential schools with Mac Labs and endowing Instructors would not change today, but assure tomorrow. It took Apple years to get to it's current position and it will not get out of it overnight.
19. anonymous
We might be zealots, but it's not without a reason. We have great technology, that MS has copied over and over and over again, and it's users have no grasp of the differences in our OS. Actually, I can't even THINK of a decent technology (not designed to push ms formats) that didn't start on Macs first. For example, would you have USB if it were not for firewire? I don't think so. Would there be 'luna' interface if not for 'aqua'? Ha! fat chance! PC users and even IT managers by and large don't care much about technology, just want to get what everyone else is using, or collect a paycheck managing it with MS sanctioned and overpriced servers and admin tools. A lot of Mac users are into technology (some are 'loyal' just for ease of use, but mostly nowadays (those who are left) tend to have a very good grasp of technolgy. In general, we know a lot more about windows than you do about Mac. We don't like windows and we can't understand how anyone in their right mind could actually prefer it.
You think Mac users give abuse, you have no idea what it's like to be one. You can't walk into an electronics store (other than the apple store) and not hear a constant deluge of miss-information, etc...
20. George Wedding
Mr Jancek writes:
...Run an article about Apple and you usually get a steady trickle of reader comments. Run one that questions or criticises any aspect of Apple strategy, products or leadership and the trickle becomes a deluge. And the accusations of 'Mac bashing' soon follow...
This point would be accurate, if only it read, "Run an article that contains innacurate reporting about Apple..." The fact is Apple customers are sick and tired of shoddy technology reporting filled with biased, half-truths and we're not gonna' take it anymore.
21. anonymous
Obligatory concession: hateful vitriol usually does more harm than good, at least in the court of public opinion.
That being said, I sometimes disagree with how easy the Mac user base capitulates everytime time a IT professional cries about getting their feelings hurt. The fact is, sometimes you need to call a moron a moron and a liar a liar. (recent pres. election not withstanding)
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but if the PC press held their so-called 'experts' to a standard of quality or accountability, there might not need to be so agressive a response.
If a layman on the street says that Apple is irrelevent, then that's just an opinion. And we can probably figure out where he got that opinion.
But when an IT professional says it, it smacks of either a deliberate attempt to misinform for self-serving reasons, (Rob Enderle, Paul Thurrott) or a complete lack of understanding of their alleged field of expertise. (Any executive at Creative)
A geologist that says the Earth is flat deserves to be called to the Mat more so than a high school drop out living in a trailer somewhere in Arizona.
Is there any doubt that Micheal Dell knows better than what he says about the iPod? So why does the PC industry Press give him a free pass?
I work at a MAJOR silicon valley technology company. Just when the common sense of a virus-resistant, unix-based platform was being realized by certain departments, the IT 'leadership' made certain strategic partnerships with PC vendors (read: HP) that DISALLOWED Macs to be purchased by the company.
So when the PC press, IT 'leadership' and competition figureheads all float their deliberate falsehoods and couple them with backroom underhanded deals, I'd argue that a vociferous response from those being forced to grab their ankles is not only appropriate, but necessary.
22. Guido Chiappini
Ha, ha, ha. IT "pros" simply can't approve Mac OS: they'll loose their jobs.
IT depts are powerful: they can say "this is hard" and everybody bows. Mac OS is all about empowering users, and encouraging people to act creatively.
When this happens in a company, two things materialize: a slight chaos and almost total irrelevancy of IT "pros".
People is not terrified by the PC anymore: everyone thinks everything's possible.
And IT "pros" loose their grip. Spending is less than before, because of Mac's lifespan, so budgets are going to shrink. Eventually less people is needed to manage the IT dept.
Everything translates in a loss of power, so why should IT "pros" hail Apple?
If those who hire CIOs were to understand this, maybe things would change. Until then, let them play with Windows.
23. Chris Christensen
There is another possibility here. Maybe the articles really were wrong. The CIO Jury article states that Apple is irrelevant to business. Apple's server business has doubled in 2004 and is likely to do so in 2005 as well. In particular their storage solutions (XServe RAID) are really shaking up the Unix server market. We have seen Sun on one occasion throw in a free Sun raid array to try and compete with Apple. So if Sun thinks Apple is relevant... is it possible that some journalists are too sensitive? :-)
24. anonymous
If you want to avoid the wrath of the Apple informed it's easy:
1. Become informed yourself (I mean really informed)
2. Loose the attitude (It went out in the nineties)
3. Interview other INFORMED IT Pros (Actual users)
4. Look at what is actually happening with Apple products, not just some ignorant prejudices regurgitated for your readership
25. Christian Jansen
Well written, Mr. Janacek. As an Apple die-hard for life, and a sr. windows admin to feed the hole in my face, it's hard to understand why anyone can't understand why the Mac is so much better than windows. The amount of time, money, energy spent by my organization to patch our global (300+ countries) windows network is sickening. The fact that it is so easily avoidable makes it even worse.
While we like to think that Apple is infallible, we know they are not. And it's hard to listen to people who know nothing about the Mac discredit it. We choose not to be sheep, and are simply trying to help others "free their minds." Sometimes the ignorance of the weak-minded just PI%&ES us off enough to let them know about it. If I had a dollar for every time I've listened to someone who has never used Mac OS X explain why it isn't as good as windows, I would be a very rich man.
26. anonymous
This is the most biased crap I've ever seen. I've never heard of silicon.com...your editors won't approve this comment, so it won't go at the bottom of the page.
(Ed note. Just goes to show what you know! Though not sure you've really done much to progress the debate, but thanks for visiting.)
27. Jack A
I think the most relevant point that has been made here for silicon.com is that care should be taken that articles are balanced and factual.
If an article contains opinions which could be considered biased and perhaps inflammatory, care should be taken that the opposing opinion is fairly and equally represented. It would be fairly easy to illicit inflamed responses on almost any subject if this formula of journalistic integrity is not followed.
28. Brian Richardson
The first question that comes to mind when I read a column quoting a group of IT Captains of Industry is whether those individuals use both Windows and OSX on a daily basis. Without this frame of reference, I find their opinions unworthy of respect. And, this goes both ways, in my opinion. Mac users who diss Windows but don't use it are just as susceptible to this corrosive tribal wisdom.
29. William Taggart
Yay! Lovely article. It's pathetic reading something along the lines of Mac vs. Win on the web (any site, really) and while the article may be good or bad, if the site allows comments, they almost invariably turn into shouting matches, name calling, cursing, etc. You're right -- the time is past and people in corporate IT may be reading these things for the first time. Time to clean it up.
30. James Bailey
Those 12 CIOs should be questioned. Abuse isn't appropriate but it is an open forum, what can you do? But the idea that the 12 CIOs shouldn't have been questioned on their outrageous attitudes is a ridiculous position for Silicon.com to take.
(Ed note. It's pretty clear that's never been suggested. The article merely questions the inarticulate vitriole which does nothing to further the debate.)
They are flat out wrong and they are likely to cost their respective companies serious money. My opinion but shared by many others.
When you get an outpouring of sentiment against your jury, isn't it warranted to take another look at who you selected? They had literally no support in their opinions on your forum. We can't all be just fanatics.
31. John Francini
I'm the IT manager for a small marketing company. Our shop is mostly Mac, with a very small handful of PCs used where they have to be -- to run QuickBooks for accounting, and for UPS shipping computers. The five PCs in the shop cause me far more trouble than the 25 Macs combined.
I've spent over 24 years involved with computers, over half spent at Digital Equipment Corporation, another company whose products were far better than the competition.
Having used "real computers" (DECsystem-10s, DECSYSTEM-20s, VAXen) running bulletproof operating systems, I was utterly aghast at the rise of the well-packaged, well-marketed, but utterly mediocre Windows OSes.
There is absolutely zero reason why users and administrators of a computer should have to go to the ridiculous lengths PC users have to in order to protect them from the entire bestiary of cyber-infectious agents that plagues the Windows platform.
Microsoft has much to answer for in this area. Their current strategy of buying anti-virus and anti-spyware companies in order to (perhaps) bundle them with Windows is a mere band-aid on a problem that can only be fixed by a complete ground-up re-write of Windows and Office.
The Macintosh, by comparison, was and remains the best overall implementation of a computer system since DEC's halcyon days. And with the advent of Mac OS X, it's even better. Granted, there are areas I'd like to see improved (ECC memory on desktop/laptop systems, a more user-friendly set of command-line tools instead of the typical collection of powerful but inscrutable UNIX tools), but all in all it's a huge improvement over Redmond-ware, and the best-balanced system for users.
32. anonymous
This comment:
"If any corporate or IT decision maker lets a product's users influence -- in any way, shape, or form -- their decision of whether or not the product is a feasible fit for their needs, I would seriously question the competency of their decision-making process."
just proves the point.
What he is saying is "You stinky little users won't decide what computer you get at your company based on what "works best for you," I, the high-priest of IT will decree it! And my 2 years at ITT tell me Windows is superior!
This is the idiotic nonsense that insures that millions of good dollars are thrown after bad because the people being asked what to buy are elitist and closed-minded in their opinions.
This is the attitude that often gets "ram-rodded" by Apple fans. Any wonder? Who the h-ll does "wire-boy" think he is, the crown prince of "Corporate Kingdom." Get it into your little brain, buddy; You are the tail! The people you are demeaning (the actual producers) are the dogs. Not the other way around.
33. Kal McGinnis
It seems that Dell and others easily dismiss Apple's products, but I find it equally strange to see the "Wintel World" trying to match Apple's ease of use and integration of hardware and software only to fail miserably in the execution. I work on both platforms and find the Dells and HPs taking much too much of my time in repair or virus fighting, while the Apple products are working productively.
34. anonymous
I agree with the core content of this article, but as many other posters have pointed out there is a substantial anti-mac bias in the professional IT media. Silicom.com would do well to admit that. The IT profession basically exist to serve the Microsoft community and many of them are ignorant when it comes to how Apple hardware and software actually performs. What is frustrating is that these IT professionals will never admit to not knowing what they're talking about, but rather are quick to codemn the entire Mac platform with little or no research or experience. It's frustrating, it's like being a Democrat and watching Fox News. You know that they are spreading misinformation but what can you do?
35. Zato
"(Ed note. In so many ways this probably proves a point.)"
The point that Silicon.com really needs to prove is that you are not an agent of a Microsoft conspiracy of dis-information re Apple and Linux, and that you are not a bought and paid for sales tool to sell Microsoft to IT.
36. Kevin Cullis
As one who uses Linux, Mac, and Windows XP Pro, I come from a business perspective and not out of loyalty to any OS. Each OS has it's place but as we've all heard the comments from some leaders in the past: "The world has room for only 5 computers" and "Who needs more than 640k." They were wrong! The 12 CIOs are no different in my mind, they need to rethink their comments of the Mac or Linux and seriously consider at what point does it make sense to deploy them. I heard of one CIO of a Forture 500 company who state when Open Source was becoming a big thing that he sent out an email stating that "no open source software" would be used by their company, not realizing the system administrators of all of his servers had a decision to make: either shutdown the servers or eat his words after being told the DNS and Bind used in ALL servers are open source. The Jefferson County CIO here in Colorado has moved almost all (or all) of their servers to Linux and is migrating more desktops every month. So, it's not irrelevant, but when!
37. anonymous
Interesting article. What I note is that since Apple introduced the XServe and worked on adding greater functionality and industry standard components to both OS-X and OS-X Server, Apple has taken a very low-key approach to promoting its solutions to the IT Enterprise.
Talking with Apple reps and product managers at trade shows, it is clear that they understand that patience, persistence and performance will win the day for Apple. They clearly understand that Microsoft is deeply entrenched in the IT world, and that deep prejudice against and misunderstandings about Apple hold strong with many IT managers. That's a given for them.
But my conversations with Apple product managers made it clear to me that they know their long-term success will be based on patiently and persistently proving that the Mac is not a toy, but a viable solution for business. That will take time. Old views die hard.
By walking instead of running, by listening instead of spewing hype, Apple is, in my opinion, taking the right tack. It's not to say that Microsoft and Intel-based investments in the entrprise will be washed away tomorrow; quite the opposite. I think Apple is targeting markets in which they can get a fair hearing. And over time, the IT world will take a closer look at Apple and its hardware/software offerings.
In time, Apple could well be viewed more positively by the IT world. When respected IT industry journalists such as Tom Yager of InfoWorld feel the Mac is a viable alternative, that speaks volumes. And that's what I listen to.
One final thought: my apologies for other Mac users being so emotional in their response to your original article. Passion can blind the well-intentioned. But the bottom line remains this: Apple is worth a look. I really believe that if IT managers suspend their old prejudice and disbelief, that Apple's offerings will be a pleasant surprise to many.
38. anonymous
In essence you are admitting in this article that CIOs are not making objective decisions concerning the mac. I agree.
39. Spongy
Anytime a factual error is pointed out in a professional manner it does not seem to matter. I get the usual...Mac Zealot, Mac FanBoy (seems to be the cop out du-jour), Mac faithful, It's like a cult nonsense. I've used Macs for years. They are a tool. I use them to make a living. If they were junk I would not be using them. Time is money. Like many Mac users I have also used Windows. It's hard to avoid. It is a Windows world. So I have made an informed decision. Most of the people that say these things have hardly touched or never used a Mac. Their opinion is usually not based on experience or knowledge. So where is there opinion derived from? A preconceived notion. A herd mentality. How can you have an informed opinion on something you have not experienced? Reading about how to fly a plane does not make you a pilot.
40. Peter Nord
I've been using computers for over forty years. Just counted on my fingers how many different operating systems I've used, lost track after 15. My last of four different Thinkpads sits unused in my office as I find I can do everything in the business with a Powerbook.
Try a little experiment. Write an article about the virtues of a Mac with OS X. See what happens. Tell some Windows users you are thinking about getting a Mac. Walk into a computer store mentioning you are thinking of Mac. Write about the reactions you get. Do some research to see if the Mac user's opinion of lower total cost of ownership has a factual basis, etc.
Perhaps you can do some investigative journalism into various myths held on both sides of the Mac/PC factions. Would make interesting reading.
41. anonymous
The dirty little secret of IT departments everywhere is that their love of Microsoft software is just like it used to be for the love of IBM hardware: you never get fired for buying it and while it may not be the best of breed out there it will keep your support headcount and budget protected. How else can anyone justify keeping Internet Explorer on corporate PC's with access to the Internet when Firefox is available? Management rights are locked-down but a user's PC effectively has an open sore to the whole world which results in lots and lots of support calls and desk visits by the IT staff. None of it their fault, of course, and nicely keeping them in work. Switch to Macintosh or thin clients? That would be self-defeating while the blame for everything can still be safely laid at the feet of the "safe, corporate" choice. That's why businesses too small to have an IT department or very large enterprises with critical functions like call centers or e-commerce don't rely on Microsoft - they can't afford to.
42. Papa Tony
It's just payback time. Where do you think that all of that angry energy COMES FROM?
I've been a Mac computer consultant since the Mac Plus days, and I have ZERO patience left for anti-Mac pinheads. I can name hundreds of times when I'd be in polite company, or working on a Mac surrounded by hundreds of PC's, or talking with a stranger on a plane, and had the jerk opposite me start gleefully insulting Macs with enormous hatred and ignorance. Somehow, I was expected to just stand there and meekly take it, but I never would.
Now that things are much better for Apple, I'm STILL not willing to put up with hateful ignorance. If somebody is going to say something incredibly stooopid on a topic that I know vastly more about, I will correct them. Factually and firmly.
The anti-Mac bigots created a siege mentality among the Mac faithful, and now they have to deal with it. Tough beans.
43. Bakuryuuha
Mac users truly do believe in their technology, believe that Apple's hardware and software are superior to all other offerings. However, I don't think we'd be so evangelical if we didn't know we were absolutely right. For CIOs to be interviewed and flat out say "no" to Apple with no base of evidentiary reason why Windows would be preferable to Macintosh ...
"Macs don't run MS Office" - oops, try again. "Macs can't integrate into our corporate network" - oops, try again! "Uh, uh ... Macs don't run Windows!" - hell, even that one's false thanks to Microsoft's own VPC, plus other offerings like iEmulator.
If CIOs bothered to look past the traditional 'Mac is a toy' stance and actually take a peek at the hardware and software specs, they'd see things that could totally improve their company's IT experiences and budgets. Of course, that's why alot of CIOs won't get Macs -- they'd have to fire most of their IT staff, possibly even resign themselves, because not only do they not know Mac, but Mac doesn't break down as much as Windows does and there's no virii and there's fewer "critical security updates" to apply. "Job security" is top reason why technical advisors won't recommend to upper management and boards of directors to switch over to Mac, it has nothing to do with technology itself, it's a money thing -- and not to save the company money, but rather to fill IT guys pockets.
44. Jose L. Hales-Garcia
Laughable. The Microsoft bloggers and e-journalists take no responsibility for their trolling the Mac community. I can't believe that they are actually injured by the reactions, afterall they generate more traffic to their sites with their calculated attacks. The likes of Thurrott are blantantly disingenuous. You just have to see the tone Thurrott conducts between his sites Network-Nexus and WinSuperSite. People like Thurrott either have a personal vendetta against Jobs and company, or are on the Microsoft payroll, or are just working the masses in order to impress their sponsors with their traffic numbers.
If the Microsoft journalists want to call a truce they should lead by example. Quit slamming Apple with their ridiculous claims.
It has become a food fight to be sure. Do we really want the teacher to call a time out? Then the internet would be boring and we'd quit playing in it.
45. Rohan Samahon
I can attest that much of the vitriolic enmity is real. This comes in response to a general unwillingness by the IT Professional-world to reevaluate the changing technological playing-field outside of their usual sphere of resources.
I am always impressed when I read of institutions like Virginia Tech who decided to look at Apple's offerings and attempt to make it work. All too often, IT-decision-makers go with what is the standard-fare for a given task rather than looking for an even better solution. Ignorance to Apple's offerings is rampant and maligning.
True, Apple can always listen more and respond in more agile ways but this is certainly not a unique behavior. It is terribly frustrating when viruses are spreading at pandemic speeds and potential loss of data through spyware and malware pervades that Windows-centric IT departments refuse to loosen the grip of their reality and try something else. And when some do they often look to a less mature offering in the Linux world because they've heard Linix is 'cool'. CIO's are not infallible, they're human too. In fact, they too may be victim to the red state/blue state mentality that ignores real concerns in favor of holding onto to a popular dogma.
46. Dana Sibera
Speaking as a Mac user, Mac users are nuts. That's a pretty broad generalization and not the entire truth, but for the effect we give the rest of the world that core group of us who overreact give the impression that the rest of us follow.
I'm reminded of a piece on an overclockers site about a PC user who came across a G5 Power Mac case, and fit a PC motherboard and assorted parts into it. Essentially he'd made a PC with a case as good looking as any powermac.
The guy got death threats. Normally sane Mac users I talk to online went into diatribes on how rich people shouldn't be allowed to do things like this, he was spoiled, and would obviously grow into a life of crime. A mac-using psychologist ranted about his probable illness, and what he was trying to prove or make up for. All for modifying what's just a piece of aluminum and plastic.
I'll admit to being obsessive about my Macs, and I have several. They're nice machines that do what I want of them, and if the chance arises to promote them I'll do that from time to time. That's worlds apart from death threats over changing a motherboard though, and if I'm criticised for using a mac, that's all it comes to. Why bother reacting?
47. Robin Willcourt
As a long time Mac user in a very Mac-hostile hospital environment, with the IT department making outrageous claims that our localized node of Macs was placing the security of the entire hospital's Win NT network in jeopardy, it is hard not to be cynical about Mac attacks. (Especially when so many of the criticisms are not fact based.)
Over many discussions with IT people in the medical community, it has become all too clear that most of them did not know about or have any experience with Mac OS, that the cost of changing over viewed in the short term far outrode any long term gains and that ease of use was NOT ever in the equation. One reads of the mortified reaction of IT managers to the inference that they have bigger budgets and more job security by staying with MS (not to mention the 'goodies' one gets for being an MS specialist) yet more than a couple have told me exactly that! As one other reader noted, the outright relegation of Apple OUT of Enterprise should be reason enough to fire those individuals since they are not bringing expertise and balance to their job. There are now many examples of Apple in Enterprise and these entities have laid waste to the traditional IT manager stance, so pitifully enunciated by those high ranking experts in the survey. Pity Enterprise where these folks serve as the guiding lights!
48. Frank McNulty
The problem with the interview with the 12 IT guys wasn't the "dissing" of Apple, it was that these guys in the position they are, came across across as narrow minded, esepecially since they are charged with care of their company's tech infrastructure.
49. anonymous
vitriole and abusive criticisms are not only embarrassing for me as a Mac fan, but they reflect the utter lack of intelligence that i'd like to think Mac users have in ample amounts. call someone a name and you've already lost their respect...how do you expect them to listen to you? i'm all for extolling the virtues of the Mac, but even i cannot stomach the whiners and unintelligent commentors that i find on various forums.
50. anonymous
If Apple or any computer maker can convince a corporation they will actually make more money (or spend less on IT costs), they will win in the corporate space.
Corporations have a huge investment in the Windows computers, software, etc. The cost of moving to Mac is something slowing the process.
Show them the money and they'll buy the boxes. I think Apple is and Corporations will come around.
51. Ian B Jaillet
Hi Seb,
Interesting and enlightening article! I've noticed this same behavior over the years ( I've been an Apple user since '89 ) and have scratched my head over it. I can only conclude that you're seeing yet another demonstration from what I've come to term the "Rudest Generation". You know, the folks who believe only their opinions count and shout down anyone who disagrees. I've noticed these folks also never give their names - rudeness is often linked to lack of self respect and cowardlyness. Keep up the good work!
52. Brad Arendt
Comments like these from the CIO Jury article are why mac users get so frustrated and tend to react, some not so favorably, granted.
"Richard Yeo, CTO at easyGroup, simply stated: "Proprietary hardware and software, overpriced, few applications."
Cost was an issue highlighted by other IT chiefs.... the company needs to address supply, price and integration issues to break into the corporate mainstream."
This is clear misinformation when just last year one of the top supercomputers in the world was made from an Xserve for a fraction of the cost of other computers on the list. The Mac Mini is also a great price competitor, granted just released, but very competitive on price AND software applications (most businesses run office). Why are these IT pros so uninformed espcially in the server market?
And last there were the comments about macs not having virus/malware due to low penetration. This argument defies all logic and is one I find very frustrating. Let's give the point no virus/malware exists due to low market penetration. So you are then going to NOT go with this system because no one is writting virus/malware for it? Which means you ARE going to stay with a system which constantly is having problems with virus/malware?
In the entire article you have no one OBJECTIVELY looking at the platform. Have they ACTUALLY compared costs or just going on rumor/gut? Now, none of that justifies name calling but I can see how some people would get their feathers bunched up so to speak.
53. John Hauxwell
As a Mac and PC user I will say that the business community has yet to grasp the principle that a machine made for "creatives" could be any use in the "real" world.
People who slam Macs for their technology aspect really dont understand macs at all. Hello UNIX Hello RISC Hello Multitasking. Hello World.
Time was that a Mac was out on a limb. but the PowerPC revolution changed all that. The RISC 601 changed the goal posts in expected performance.. and WINTEL has never caught up... and OSX now is bringing realistic UNIX to the desktop and really asking questions of Windows(isnt that the goal of IBM and others?)
Macintosh is the way forward, RISC and UNIX they are setting the pace, and what about the Servers and Distributed Computing arenas where Macs have great strengths.
Perhaps the Personal Computer world should wake up and realise that just because it has a MAC badge, doesnt make it a bad idea. PDAs, UNIX based desktops, AUX Servers, RISC,Multitasking computing and Portable music devices have all spun out of the "Steve Jobs reality distorsion field" perhaps its the people looking from a different perspective who have the distorted view?
54. anonymous
Where are the more balanced reports? That is the question. We like to see articles in which Mac ARE used in corporate environments and want to hear THOSE people talk what are the good and bads of Macs. We want to have well-balanced reports of managers who favor PC's and those who favor Macs or others systems and we want to learn why. And we want reporters to write how their decisions are being formed. We also want reporters not just to print the voices of people but questioning their voices - even those who favor Macs, if necessary. Then it becomes an article of: Are IT managers well-informed? Now it's just an article of: Here are a bunch of IT managers who think that Apple is not ready for prime time. Such an article makes Apple irrelevant by stating the obvious culture in the IT world - even though that wasn't the intention. Isn't it more interesting to learn about the REAL uses of Macs in the corporate world, then choosing to voice a couple of opinions? If journalism is about informing people, then it's time to inform the world AND these IT people about choices and the pros and nays. There will always be opinions, but opinions are swayed by information provided by good journalism.
55. Richard
Re: "This is the most biased crap I've ever seen."
Perhaps "Anonymous" needs to get out more. Maybe read some books and newspapers. Y'know, the kind with more words than pictures.
And if he's "never heard of silicon.com..." how did he chance upon this article?
Does he trawl the web every morning looking for Apple Bashers (as he sees it) to flame? How deeply, tragically sad.
Doctor Rich says Anonymous should stop bashing his own Apple, get a name and get out into the real world. I am sure he will find far worse "crap" and more scurrilous bias than an article (written by a Mac user) about how some lunatic Mac fans are something of an embarrassment to the rest of us.
But thanks for proving the point.
Now, can we please get on with the important business of convincing the CIO Jury and their peers that Apple does indeed have relevant products to offer business.
56. G. Smith
A Mac makes me feel special...
I must be more intelligent than the masses because they all use Windows.
If they all used Macs then I'd have to use Windows.
Get a Mac...
Maybe you'll feel special too?
57. Alan Ainsworth
I have been using Macs almost since their inception. I have been an IS Consultant to the Financial Services industry almost as long.
Apart from their use in DTP (for external reporting) I have only once seen a report of Macs being deployed "in anger" - as a foreign exchange trading platform in a small bank.
The FX dealers were enraptured.
Since then, silence. Except for the (usually polite) enquiries as to why I would use a Mac Powerbook when "everyone knew" there was no software for the Mac.
A demonstration of Word, Excel, PP, a better browser and a better e-mail client (all from Microsoft), Filemaker Pro, 4D and plenty of other stuff usually ends the enquiry. Rarely does anyone want to find out more.
For myself, I welcome the opportunity to explore new platforms, new applications and new development models.
It seems that my professional colleagues and the CIO Jury don't. How sad.
58. jason scholl
Whew! I run 10 Macs on a very Windows-centric network, and I just realized how much the IT dept's attitude toward me and mine is colored by the "filth and the fury" that they see coming from Mac evangelists. Thanks for the reality check!
59. Joe Cairns
I just wanted to comment on the MAC users who stand up for the convictions, I currently have multiple MAC's, multiple LINUX and Multiple Windows based system and they ALL work in the Coporate environment. I prefer to use my MAC's they are more stable, secure, and faster then the other systems. Over the last serveral years I have held many positions in compaines and I have been preaching the viability of MAC's in the coporate environment but I did not have to use profanity or verbal abuse to get my point across.
I think if we approach this in a professional manner CIO's might be more open to suggestions.
I took the approach of getting a MAC for the office to do a proof of concept and it seems to be working. People are coming up to me stating that they want one because when the last virus hit I was working and they were not.
These are just my thoughts on this.
60. Adam Vertran
I am a mac user....well i was, until my mac became full of problems... so I had to return to a PC. I do not really understand people who "feel special" because they own a mac. If you believe that a computer can make you feel special maybe you need a psychologist.
61. anonymous
Post an intelligent article like this one - get intelligent (mostly) responses.
Post illinformed, uneducated and misleading articles - people are going to respond.
The responses to this article have gone a long way in proving this point.
62. James Bailey
From the article: "Many questioned the competence and motivation of our CIOs. It didn't make pretty reading."
What I wrote: "But the idea that the 12 CIOs shouldn't have been questioned on their outrageous attitudes is a ridiculous position for Silicon.com to take."
Your comment inserted into my comment: "(Ed note. It's pretty clear that's never been suggested. The article merely questions the inarticulate vitriole which does nothing to further the debate.)"
It is pretty clear to me, that the article is not just questioning "inarticulate vitriole" (is that a british spelling of vitriol?). It is attempting to say that anyone who disagrees with your jury is not to be listened to.
63. Andrew Bowman
Having recently read "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance," I think I better understand the approach and mindset of the Mac community. The goal is peace of mind. Features play a part in this, for if you lack the features to complete your goals (work or personal) on your computer, you will not achieve that peace. However, ease of use and good (Quality) design results in enhanced productivity, less stress, and that oh-so-important peace of mind. This is most likely what Mac users are describing when they say their computer makes them feel "special." It's not some touchy-feely magical delusion that some people believe it to be. It's the recognition of a Quality product which allows them to meet goals and grants them peace of mind during use.
I'm not saying Apple is a full-blown Quality product, but in comparison, I feel it is closer to this than Windows. This may change as time goes on.
64. Richard Sarson
'Twas always thus. In my youth, ICL and the American seven dwarfs were always streets ahead technically of Snow White (IBM), but made little impact in the global market. Now, Apple and Linux are streets ahead of Windows. With the same result. Brute force, not intelligence, has always ruled the world. The CIO jury are just the agents.
65. vic hansen
One of the more interesting possibilities opened up by IBM's sale of their PC business is a closer tie in with Apple. IBM have the credibility to get Macs into corporate accounts. Apple use IBM technology under the covers. If I can think of this idea then someone at IBM (and at Apple) is certainly making a YES/NO decision now.
66. Hid S
Apples allow users to empower themselves?
Hello?
Talk about following the Apple religion! hahaha.
Sorry, I don't care if it's Apples or PCs, your average user really doesn't care about being empowered.
They wanna go in, work, go home.
I find it hilarious to read also that people believe that u can get rid of IT Managers if u have an Apple network.
Oh, that must be cos the users empower themselves.
HAHAHAHA.
Honestly, whatever next?
Oh, hang on, were those comments made in jest to back up the article?
More importantly, why don't silicon.com use a proper forum so that people can discuss stuff properly. This incredibly slow-to-update thing is no good.
Is it something to do with Macs? (ONLY JOKING!!!!!)
67. anonymous
As Macs proliferate the workplace, so will Mac Viruses. It is a numbers game. Win OS suffers from virus attacks as a lot of people use them, if apple up their market share in the corporate workspace, then virus writers will target that OS. Mac will then be in a similar position ot other OS's releasing patches to fix problems caused by viruses.
68. Stephen B Streater
I bought my first Mac just over a month ago. Up until now, my computers have been made by Acorn and Psion, both machines which just work with no tech support requirement year after year. No need for perpetual expenses - so neither company survived making computers.
So now I find my iPOD and G5 PowerMac are not quite as reliable as the Acorns and Psions, but the Mac works in some intangible way much better than the PCs I use from time to time at work. The system set itself up when I bought it, unlike the Linux machines we use for development. I think it's because the Mac was designed.
So I am happy with my new computer. And everyone knows it too. The Linux users envy the 30" screen, and the 8GB RAM, but the most important thing for me is that it just works.
69. anonymous
"People are fed up with PCs crashing all the time" said the guy at the MAC shop when interviewed on TV recently! I run a dozen online applications and two servers simultaneously on my XP machine, have done for years. I can count the number of times it has crashed on two fingers, the same two I stick up to the MAC posters complaining about "MAC myths"... hypocrites! I have worked as the only PC user in numerous design studios where the MAC techies cant even get the PC to connect to a printer. Get a life, get a PC.
70. David J Walker
Astounding how some people can get their knickers in such a twist over a couple of essentially functionally identical pieces of office equipment.
Those whom the Gods wish to destroy they first make mad.
71. anonymous
Maybe its an over reaction, maybe its a fair, but as a Mac fan looking out its easy to see why. For so long Mac users were fighting to see a platform recognised for what it did well. Deliver solutions that actually match - if not exceed the hype.
I now work in a Windows centric world. I see 'that' point of view. And it makes me feel ven more evangelistic because Windows users, in the main, cannot even appreciate the arguements. Dell - you too such have such a passing fad!
72. Jerry Underwood
Seb misses the point when criticizing Mac evangelists. While it may do no good for a vocal minoity to carry the Apple flag, it doesn't hurt when a distinctly anti-Apple message is given such a broad platform.
Asking 12 IT wizards (who are deeply entrenched in a Microsoft/Intel world) if the Mac can make it in the business world, is a lot like asking horse breeders ( in the early 1900s) if the automobile can possible make it. They have a vested interest in saying no.
Thats why mac evangelists can be so vitriolic. The question that Seb should ask is: if so many wintel evangelists despise microsoft , why do they continue to neglect the innovations that Apple brings to the workplace.
The hidden answer is cost; not the cost of the products themselves, but the cost of the entire support structure. Very few IT managers have knowledge of the Mac at the level they do Microsoft OS, Linux and Unix.
As more and more industries experiment with Apple’s products, they build a working knowledge of the Mac OS. That is great news for Apple. Because in the industries that Apple does have a foothold, one would just as soon shoot themselves as use a PC.
73. Kevin Purell
Our fervor is fully justified.
The authors comments here reflect a bias founded only on "safety in numbers" thinking. My own fervor for Macs comes not only from how dependable they are and longstanding have been, but also from being casually insulted by PC owners who in many cases dont even know how to power up their computers. This is all too superficial and your comments continue in that same vane of superficiality.
I have driven a 12 cylinder Mercedes and know that it is like no Ford or GM or even Toyota. I have driven the equivalent in the computer world and the brand label on it is Apple.
If you want to talk about an overpriced [and humanly inaccessible] computer try complaining about the age-old Sun workstation--not a Mac.
Perhaps how the Mac/Apple fans express themselves could be cleaned up, but their right to respond with overwhelming fervor to the insults, myths, and misconceptions that they (WE) endure to this day is fully justified.
74. Plan B
What a bunch of geeks. Seriously, when I'm on my Mac for the most part I'm working. When I'm on my home Mac trying to do anything fun, I have to make sure that the site has Quicktime downloads or else it won't play any other file type. Mac is good-looking technology that's obsolete the week it drops. I bought an iPod recently only to realize that once your songs are on it, there's no exporting them to another iTunes, even if you have two Macs as I stupidly do. It's this blatant consumer disregard however that makes me not subscribe to the nation of Mac followers. They're terrible computers and for the most part, so specified in their application that god forbid, you're faced with anything other than a fully endorsed Mac-seal-of-approval application they might as well all but shut down...amen for asddressing it.
75. anonymous
For me, it's the shoddily done groundwork in Microsoft that tips in favour of Apple. I used Windows until 2001, when I switched to Linux. I was rather happy with it until I saw the Mac OS X system. It was so powerful, yet elegant in every way. I also lacked a lot of the SNAFUS seen in Windows and Linux and a year ago I bought a PowerBook. It is, by far, the most error-free computer I have ever experienced.
Microsoft, on the other hand, seem to err in whatevery they do. Just look at the Windows Server ad sometimes appearing on the right in this very page. They have managed to put Switzerland in Latvia or Ukraine. Bravo.
76. Peter Stearn
Security is key in my view. I'm not yet an Apple mac user and have heard that Mac security is much better than a PC's. Next time I buy a new computer I'm getting a Mac, my reasoning being that Apple security can't be worse than Microsoft's. The only thing that might change my mind is Microsoft making security their number one priority and this is incorporated into their products in a way that can easily be controlled/setup by the end user.
77. anonymous
I would guess that the reason for all the aggressive replies concerning apple bashing, is because these are users (like myself) who have already gained a lot of experience using Microsoft products, who have, in turn, had countless bad experiences. This led to them trying out apple and finding it rather useful and reliable. All the people that I know who nowadays own a mac, used to work on Windows systems. These are proffessionals in the IT industry.
78. Stuart Vine
Having watched the first Mac v Windows war, followed by the Linux v Windows war, and now back to Macs again, I am constantly bemused by the fact that grown people can actually get passionate about operating systems. Personally I don't care what I use, as long as I can use the application software I need.
The upside is that these little tiffs keep some seriously disturbed people off the streets and in dark rooms where they belong.
79. Jens Chr. Vig
Concerning the "12 wise men" (the IT top executives). Just some years ago the top executive in the World of PS's, said that Internet had no interesting future. Bill G in the autumn of 1995 (Either 1995 or 1996). In historic time there is less than 40 years ago, that either the top executive or one of the top executives in IBM said about computers that there is no real use for them, perhaps there would be use for about four machines in the world. Approx. 6 months before one of the last Wall Street Big Bangs, top economic advisers in U.S.A. said that there was no bad signs in the economy, and that it would be sound for many years to come.
To rephrase it: When I read about the "12 wise men", I chuckled and said to myself, that history will be the judge!
80. Brutus
Macs in a corporate environment do not work. We have a small design team on macs, G5's OSX blah blah. After terrible service from Apple, it took 2 months to get our equipment only to have one of them be a DOA. Getting it fixed?? Ha from an Apple 'approved' support centre? What a joke, it's been back three times. Can Apple get our contact and address details right? No. Do Macs integrate easily, if at all, with a Windows network? No.
Save time and money and get a PC.
81. Steve Nemesis
I used to sell Macs, and I still own several that I use regularly, but two months ago I bought a 3.2Ghz P4 PC that simply outguns any G5 on value for money by a long margin.
Why did I do this? Because OS X sucks big time. I have honestly never used such an unstable OS in my life (across G3's, G4's & G5's - two like that out of the box) and the interface is great if you like cheap silly animations but pathetic if you want to get work done. At least with XP you can turn the crap off!
I'm sticking with OS 9 - an operating system you don't need a degree to troubleshoot and it still works very, very well.
Kill the Dock! Fix Aqua! Sack Steve!
Maybe then I'll consider OS X...
82. anonymous
Dear Plan B
If you are so incredibly STUPID as to not know how to copy your songs from computer to computer, you don't deserve to use any computer, let alone the fastistic product that is OS X.
Go get a PC and think you are just like everyone else, you are too stupid to use a Macintosh. Get a PC and buy help from some blithely shallow PC support person. He could then use the money to buy a social life.
83. anonymous
Everyone of these IT idiots would have told you 2, 3, 4, 5, 10 years ago that Macs were no good and would be going out of business any day.
Guess what? It didn't happen.
84. Robert Jung
Rob meet Rob, sorry to contact you on the forum. You sound like me or should I say what I would say on that topic since my field is the same IT or it was when I study'd and graduated at college.
EE,CS and Physics.
I am from Missouri, Live in Kentucky and my name is Robert Jung.
Our family tree began in Germany then to Austria/Swiss then back then to PA,USA then to Woodstock,IL then all over-not sure if we are related but I googled Robert Jung to find me and found you. RobJ